[RFC] Use treasury funds for Delegations on ETH

Hey Lonser here,
that idea came up multiple times already and I wanted to take the initiative and make a gov post and a possible PTIP for it.

The idea is to deposit X amount of treasury funds ($500k - 1 million) into the Multi Delegator and make groups (or single people) representative so they can make delegations using the treasury funds on ETH.

The risk is minimal, the funds stay in custody of the PT treasury contract and the representatives just have the ability to make delegations.

Possible Representatives:
Grants Multi Sig
Executive Team Multi Sig
Community Team Multi Sig
A new ETH Delegation Multi Sig

Multi Sig representatives are more flexible because the address is fixed and members could change. But single addresses could make delegations faster in some cases.

@tim probably already has some usage for this feature if we can implement it.

Technical details (WIP, never did a PTIP before so please take a look if you have knowledge):
TWAB Delegator:

Action #1

  • Contract address: 0xdd4d117723C257CEe402285D3aCF218E9A8236E1
  • function: approve
  • spender address: 0x5cFbEE38362B9A60be276763753f64245EA990F7
  • amount uint256: 1000000000000

Action #2

  • Contract address: 0x5cFbEE38362B9A60be276763753f64245EA990F7
  • function: stake
  • _to: 0x42cd8312d2bce04277dd5161832460e95b24262e
  • _amount: 1000000000000

Action #3 - #X

  • Contract address: 0x5cFbEE38362B9A60be276763753f64245EA990F7
  • function: setRepresentative
  • representative: address
  • _set: True
Do you support this idea?
  • YES
  • NO

0 voters

Pls vote but also comment, what opinions do you have about representatives, total staked PTaUSDC?


I’d love to see this become a reality. It’s been mentioned a couple times, but never taken to the forum to get to an actual PTIP. So thanks for this Lonser.

Delegations is one of the easiest and cheapest ways for us to publicize ourselves. With this we can do special campaings to attract new depositors or incentivize existing ones.

Just one small but, if we want to do the delegations outside of Ethereum, we cannot use the timelock to hold the funds. Therefore we would probably have to use the Exec team instead.

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I think this is a great idea.

Would be a great way to showcase to new depositors and new people coming into PoolTogether to see how winning works.

Like if they only have $20 deposited and then get delegated $1/2/3/4/5k for a few weeks.

The chances of them winning at least once drastically increases and I think the likelihood of them increasing their deposit amount during or after the delegation ends would also drastically increase once they see how it all works and get a win or two.

I like this idea, but I’d like us to start with a smaller amount of funds. AFAIK contributors were currently playing around with about $100k PtUSDC. I think a sensible next step would be around $250k. We can always increase it later if the program is successful. Let’s step into this gradually.

Each delegation needs to be undelegated before funds can be withdrawn. It will take work to unwind delegations, depending on how many were made. That’s another reason I’d like to start with an amount that ideally doesn’t need to be withdrawn for a long time. A smaller amount will keep most of our treasury liquid.

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Removing delegations is a single transaction with Bulk Delegation ser! I’ve done it and it’s beautiful. I think I might have teared up! (But this was with Optimism for 15 users so mainnet might be different)

Could we start small at the management level but still allow for the deposit of 1-2 million? This is something that we’re asking of other treasuries (actually 5+ million in some cases).

Not sure what you mean here? Maybe you could clarify this a little.

Our situation is different than other treasuries, who may have millions of dollars to play with. We only have 2.5m in stables, and we are going to have Team Budget Requests occurring every quarter. Placing 1-2m into a contract that can tie those funds up (even somewhat) would make the treasury much more illiquid.

I’m all for increasing delegations, but let’s not pour a huge portion of the treasury into them! Let’s start slow and iterate. No need to rush into it, IMO.

Since this would be on Ethereum I think the amount needs to be higher. 100k works on Polygon but on Ethereum we need larger amounts to make the chances of winning better. 250k would likely be large enough if delegated for 1 month but I do still like the $1 million because I think it’s far more exciting.

I terms of liquidity. I don’t think depositing into the delegator contract makes it less liquid. It is only one more transaction to withdraw it but it is still fully liquid. If a governance proposal is going to be moving money than it will need to have a transaction anyway, adding one more to it shouldn’t be much of a problem (unless we are running up against the 10 tx limit for gov proposals).

The one concern I would have is the security of the delegator contract… just making sure we feel confident about that (I have a lot of money in it myself!).

Overall, I’d love to see this move forward and I’d hope to see us leverage the high end of this ($1 million) as I think that is what’s needed to generate meaningful excitement on Ethereum

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I just mean stake the 1 million but only delegate out a small amount to start.

A proposal has a maximum of 10 transactions; it would be very challenging for a governance proposal to manually unwind all of the delegations. It’s not simply a matter of transferring tokens.

If there are a dozen delegations or more and the rep isn’t available, it would be painstaking to unwind the delegations. We could assign another rep to clean up the delegations before withdrawing, but then it would require two proposals: one to select the new rep, and the second to withdraw.

When I say “liquid” I mean spendable tokens. The tokens in the delegator are managed by the rep and are not tokenized.

A 1/2 multi-sig solves this correct?

Bumping this Gov post up again! :slight_smile:
Talked a bit with @McOso about it and he has great ideas using delegations as a promotion tool with NFT Communities and I think combining that with the idea to use treasury funds on ETH for delegations would be cool I think!
Not sure if there is enough support to deposit 1 million into the multi delegator but I think at least 500k should be possible! :slightly_smiling_face:
Trying to to get some more feedback before making it a PTIP gov post, waiting 5 days and then putting it on chain :slight_smile:

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